the intrinsic sexiness of bog creatures

[socksuke_uchiha]

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Comments

(frozen comment) Re: ITT: NAME A THING YOU DON'T GET AND SOMEONE WILL EXPLAIN THE THING

[(Anonymous)]

what the fuck is proshipping and why do people hate it so much

(frozen comment) Re: ITT: NAME A THING YOU DON'T GET AND SOMEONE WILL EXPLAIN THE THING

[(Anonymous)]

oh OP, I hope you're prepared for the amount of worms that may come crawling out of this can... Though DWRP is probably the most 'proship friendly' (for lack of better description) fandom space you could find, since most of us are over 30. It's the posturing armchair activist fandom teens who start shit over proshipping.

Long story short: originally proshipping meant 'ship what you want to ship despite certain questionable aspects of the dynamic and leave other people alone', while antishipping was a form of purism where you would only ship things that were 'morally superior' (so no age gaps, no power imbalances, no incest, etc). But this went sour real fast and depending on which space you were in, antishipping was considered the only correct choice while every proshipper was labeled a dangerous predator who needed to be gatekept out of fandom spaces. Even though proshippers were just.... minding their own business and didn't even necessarily ship anything questionable themselves.

(frozen comment) Re: ITT: NAME A THING YOU DON'T GET AND SOMEONE WILL EXPLAIN THE THING

[(Anonymous)]

So it's basically "do what you want, i'm not going to engage with it"

i kept seeing "proshippers DNI" while engaging with a fandom for the first time in ages and wtf

(frozen comment) Re: ITT: NAME A THING YOU DON'T GET AND SOMEONE WILL EXPLAIN THE THING

[(Anonymous)]

yeah they don't want to talk to you because you might ship two adults who met as children or something and that's pedophilia

(frozen comment) Re: ITT: NAME A THING YOU DON'T GET AND SOMEONE WILL EXPLAIN THE THING

[(Anonymous)]

unfortunately there are some legitimate pedos/lolicons who hitched their wagon to proshipping, so do your due diligence if you meet someone proudly proclaiming that label

(frozen comment) Re: ITT: NAME A THING YOU DON'T GET AND SOMEONE WILL EXPLAIN THE THING

[(Anonymous)]

weird comment to leave on my comment

(frozen comment) +1

[(Anonymous)]

many of the out and proud proshippers i had the misfortune of interacting with acted like being a proshipper was a marginalized identity, not that a lot of people gave them the slip in fandom because, understandably, most people don't want to interact with shota/loli/csa, fictional or not. it was incredibly noxious to me as a racial and gender minority.

ultimately i don't care what people are into because i can't do shit about it. but i have the right to curate my space and consistently it was proshippers who tried to violate my boundaries regarding shota/loli/csa and, once refuted enough times, escalated to bigotry. i shouldn't have to tell people i'm a survivor to be left alone and often that was the wrong move anyways because they took it as a challenge

both sides are incredibly annoying but only one side took a malicious glee into trying to 'convert' me to their side. i just hit the bricks now whenever someone claims to be a proshipper

(frozen comment) Re: ITT: NAME A THING YOU DON'T GET AND SOMEONE WILL EXPLAIN THE THING

[(Anonymous)]

Yeah I would recommend not engaging with the "proshippers DNI" people. Even if you don't want to get involved with the discourse, 1. if you have an agegap or an incest ship or kink on noncon like villain wins stories or any number of other things people like that will lump you in with proshippers and treat you accordingly if you come to their notice and 2. way higher incidence of harassment among types like that. Even if they're not harassing you, I think anyone and everyone is better off looking for friends who don't do that shit.

Do you have a sense of whether the fandom skews young? I think the pro/antiship discourse tends to be amplified in young fandoms.

(frozen comment) Re: ITT: NAME A THING YOU DON'T GET AND SOMEONE WILL EXPLAIN THE THING

[(Anonymous)]

the term 'proshipping' has been catastrophized by 'antis' (antishippers) and the meaning has been warped from 'pro-shipping' to 'pro-shipping-everything-problematic-and-endorsing-pedophilia-explicitly-and-loudly'. if you see 'proshippers dni', it's someone who understands it to be the latter and who has never questioned that definition

(frozen comment) Re: ITT: NAME A THING YOU DON'T GET AND SOMEONE WILL EXPLAIN THE THING

[(Anonymous)]

…or someone who just doesn’t want to put up with the baggage that comes with the term or someone who’s actually triggered by the content proshippers engage in

idk why people keep insisting one side is worse than the other. both suck. it’s a stupid internet war. save yourself the headache and engage with neither

(frozen comment) Re: ITT: NAME A THING YOU DON'T GET AND SOMEONE WILL EXPLAIN THE THING

[(Anonymous)]

well, one side is literally using the fascist bookburning playbook to try and censor content they think is morally degenerate, so

there's that to consider

(frozen comment) Re: ITT: NAME A THING YOU DON'T GET AND SOMEONE WILL EXPLAIN THE THING

[(Anonymous)]

Frankly if all there is is “proshippers DNI” then I think it’s silly to act like that person isn’t likely discourse poisoned in their own right. “Proshippers and antis DNI” is the “just sick of the discourse” option. It’s also not what people are observing in this case, as “proshippers DNI” has been explicitly mentioned.

(frozen comment) Re: ITT: NAME A THING YOU DON'T GET AND SOMEONE WILL EXPLAIN THE THING

[(Anonymous)]

proship/antiship started as very basic terms: if you like X pairing, you were pro-X and if you didn’t, you were anti-X. i’m not sure what happened first, but personally i saw people who identified as antis justifying being anti-x because essentially problematic- age gaps, power imbalances, one character was a murderer, etc.. (this was also during the height of tumblr fandom, when stuff like harassing a artist into attempted suicide because they drew a character too skinny.) pro-x people would counter with arguments that it’s fiction, and to let people explore problematic themes in fantasy, essentially.

now it’s a identity that i don’t really get and tbh i don’t really want to. from my experience it’s claimed by people who will talk about the details of their sex life and will claim censorship if asked to stop and those guys who are very creepily into lolicon.

not that antiship is any better, since its full of people who genuinely believe in things like roadhog/junkrat is pedophilia because of the age gap.

(frozen comment) Re: ITT: NAME A THING YOU DON'T GET AND SOMEONE WILL EXPLAIN THE THING

[(Anonymous)]

i've seen antishippers claim ships between two 40+ men are pedophilia because one is shorter and more effeminate (in fandom) than the other and is "child coded"

also that if two people call each other brother or sister even in a teasing way it means their relationship is incest

(frozen comment) Re: ITT: NAME A THING YOU DON'T GET AND SOMEONE WILL EXPLAIN THE THING

[(Anonymous)]

yup. i've seen the height difference one multiple times, although there was at least one case where they weren't serious but it wasn't obvious and they got dogpiled/harassed by proshippers who couldn't recognize a joke.

i also forgot to mention that there are antishippers who are way too invested in their gay/lesbian headcanons and/or ships, and will lose their minds over people shipping their pet character with someone else and start harassing them. usually they claim that the other person is homophobic or exploiting the queer community. some even have some internal rule that women can't enjoy mlm ships and content and wlw for men. it's very stupid and it's what made me stop using twitter long before elon musk bought it because i did not want to put up with some 16 year old lecturing me about morals.

(frozen comment) Re: ITT: NAME A THING YOU DON'T GET AND SOMEONE WILL EXPLAIN THE THING

[(Anonymous)]

yeah honestly, antis who get over-aggressive really sour interaction with a franchise.

I left a specific fandom after a very bad experience where I was publicly shamed and gatekept from a zine of my favorite ship by a couple of anti teens, just because 'I gave a platform to a predator', when all I did was not immediately and publicly judge someone's unrelated age gap preferences. (still two grown adult characters, mind you.) I didn't even really know this person, but because I didn't call them out on this one other ship they also liked, the antis assumed I was friends with them and condoning pedo groomers being in fandom spaces. when I tried to give my side of the story, I was told 'stop defending yourself and let this be a learning experience' before the proverbial door got slammed in my face, but all it did was ensure I can't enjoy the source material anymore. My brain associates it with that incident now.

(frozen comment) Re: ITT: NAME A THING YOU DON'T GET AND SOMEONE WILL EXPLAIN THE THING

[(Anonymous)]

the anti/proshipping thing is a deeply unserious internet culture war

i avoid anyone who self identifies as either because it’s guaranteed unpleasantness of the too logged in no nuance i’m a partisan who can’t see the shit i’m accusing the other side of doing is the same shit we do (abuse, harassment, bigotry, et al)

i’ve been accused of all kinds of things by both sides. the last bout several years ago was weirdos sending me racist threats and trying to trigger me over my trauma with csa

i don’t have patience for either side anymore. if you identify as either it’s only a matter of time before you go off the deep end

this sarah z video explains it in detail but it is long

https://youtu.be/5OcLDcg7UJw

(frozen comment) Re: ITT: NAME A THING YOU DON'T GET AND SOMEONE WILL EXPLAIN THE THING

[(Anonymous)]

never watch a sarah z video unless you want a deeply rambling and somehow still completely shallow overview of a topic

(frozen comment) Re: ITT: NAME A THING YOU DON'T GET AND SOMEONE WILL EXPLAIN THE THING

[(Anonymous)]

Strongly feel this way about her Dashcon video; Strange Aeons did much better with that topic.

(frozen comment) Re: ITT: NAME A THING YOU DON'T GET AND SOMEONE WILL EXPLAIN THE THING

[(Anonymous)]

then recommend a better one or shut up

(frozen comment) Re: ITT: NAME A THING YOU DON'T GET AND SOMEONE WILL EXPLAIN THE THING

[(Anonymous)]

In my experience, in my circles:

Proship is associated with writing and reading whatever you want, without considering fictional content necessarily reflective of a person's moral character. Reading, writing, and making art portraying abusive relationship dynamics, age gap ships including relationships that would be pedophilia if they were real, noncon, and general dark content has the same moral weight as reading, writing, and making art portraying sweet fluffy fics and happily ever afters. It is all ok.

Antidom is associated with thinking that someone's likes in fiction reflect their morality as a person. Liking an age gap ship including those that would be pedophilic if real (and you can see in other comments this gets stretched to grown adults being "child coded" or adult characters that met as kids by some antis), noncon, etc means that you are a pedophile or a rape apologist.

I had a friend whose dark m/m fics got sent to her very traditional parents. She naturally nuked the whole account. I've also seen artists horrifically impacted by harassment campaigns rustled up by antis. My sympathy tends to be more on the proship side as I'm in favor of making and consuming whatever kind of content you want without it necessarily saying much about you. Naturally, members of both sides take it way too far and proshippers have really sucked seed too. The descriptions of proshippers defending racism and not being able to take no for an answer on their age gap lolisho content is really bad, and I know proshippers can end up going off the deep end just like antis.

If I were you I would be pretty careful with those people who have "proshippers DNI" in their profiles though, and probably would not engage with them personally at all.

(frozen comment) Re: ITT: NAME A THING YOU DON'T GET AND SOMEONE WILL EXPLAIN THE THING

[(Anonymous)]

most people nowadays don't put proshippers dni on their profiles they put both anti and proshippers dni... because the majority of reasonable people are fed up of this nonsense and are normal people who pay taxes and engage in fannish hobbies for fun

(frozen comment) Re: ITT: NAME A THING YOU DON'T GET AND SOMEONE WILL EXPLAIN THE THING

[(Anonymous)]

From this comment: https://rpanons.dreamwidth.org/99168.html?thread=284710496#cmt284710496

Not sure I've ever personally seen "antis DNI" in a profile. This seems like it'd be pretty dependent on fandom.

(frozen comment) Re: ITT: NAME A THING YOU DON'T GET AND SOMEONE WILL EXPLAIN THE THING

[(Anonymous)]

SA

I forgor a line in here.

I linked the comment bc it refers to seeing "proshippers DNI" notes in profiles. In my experience it is pretty common to have "proshippers DNI" in a profile with no word on antis at all, and that makes me pretty wary of people with those notes.

(frozen comment) +1

[(Anonymous)]

i knew it was a lost cause when i saw people grifting by writing academic theses on this subject with the shoddiest research ever, no respect nor knowledge for the culture they're stealing concepts and methodology from (japanese of course) and going all in on harassing actual minorities online and in real life to defend the honor of their fictional characters

anti pro i don't give a shit i'm blocking your ass. run-of-the-mill weebs are bad enough. self-righteous weebs are a whole 'nother tier of shit i don't want to deal with while half japanese